One engine quits when shifting forward/reverse

General repair/maintenance/upgrade information exchange.

Re: One engine quits when shifting forward/reverse

Postby nawtical1 » Mon Sep 21, 2015 8:01 am

I have been running the NGK TR 55 for years with no issues. I change them out every 2-3 years regardless of hours.
WARNER
"Sol Poniente"
2004 3860 Hard Top
2005 Crowline 216 LS 350 Magnum Bravo III
310 Rib

Slidell La.
User avatar
nawtical1
2012 Regal Owners MULTIPLE Donator!
2012 Regal Owners MULTIPLE Donator!
 
Posts: 2085
Joined: Tue Nov 20, 2007 9:42 am

Re: One engine quits when shifting forward/reverse

Postby ImRich » Mon Sep 21, 2015 9:22 am

I believe the 3861326 is actually a Denso TJ14R-P15, and not a NGK as I originally thought.

The Denso TJ14R-P15 is listed as a cross reference for the 41-983: http://www.globaldenso.com/en/products/ ... 001_1.html

Doing some research the AC-Delco 41-983 are also listed as 'double platinum', so I'm not sure what's really different here.
Rich
2005 - 3560
Unbelievable!
NH
ImRich
 
Posts: 980
Joined: Sat Apr 13, 2013 1:06 pm
Location: NH USA

Re: One engine quits when shifting forward/reverse

Postby gofast24 » Tue Sep 22, 2015 11:00 am

We have the original Denso TJ14R-P15 platinum Plugs still installed . Over 700 hours and still firing, clean, light grey , no carbon deposits and with out any problems! I would stick with the plugs that VP originally put in the engines. Engine OEM's do a massive amount of testing in conjunction with the plug manufactures to determine the correct spark plugs for the application. My guess is that Mercruiser using the same engine would have came up with the same plug recomendations.
gofast24
2001 Regal 4160
Twin VP 8.1GSiI V Drive Inboards
Lake Lanier, GA
gofast24
 
Posts: 2391
Joined: Mon Jan 26, 2015 12:03 pm
Location: Lake Lanier GA

Re: One engine quits when shifting forward/reverse

Postby ImRich » Mon Sep 28, 2015 7:53 am

This will have to continue next year as my boat was pulled this weekend.

I had no problems the last few cruises, but it only happens rarely.
Rich
2005 - 3560
Unbelievable!
NH
ImRich
 
Posts: 980
Joined: Sat Apr 13, 2013 1:06 pm
Location: NH USA

Re: One engine quits when shifting forward/reverse

Postby nawtical1 » Tue Sep 29, 2015 7:31 am

The saga continues. Sorry it could not be resolved before you were pulled.
WARNER
"Sol Poniente"
2004 3860 Hard Top
2005 Crowline 216 LS 350 Magnum Bravo III
310 Rib

Slidell La.
User avatar
nawtical1
2012 Regal Owners MULTIPLE Donator!
2012 Regal Owners MULTIPLE Donator!
 
Posts: 2085
Joined: Tue Nov 20, 2007 9:42 am

Re: One engine quits when shifting forward/reverse

Postby gofast24 » Tue Sep 29, 2015 10:28 am

ImRich wrote:This will have to continue next year as my boat was pulled this weekend.

I had no problems the last few cruises, but it only happens rarely.

Next year you might have the same problem? I dont think I will remember what the thread entailed 6 months from now. Without trying to read back 40+ posts just change the plugs if you have more than 500 hours on the propulsion engine. Only a couple bucks or so each?
gofast24
2001 Regal 4160
Twin VP 8.1GSiI V Drive Inboards
Lake Lanier, GA
gofast24
 
Posts: 2391
Joined: Mon Jan 26, 2015 12:03 pm
Location: Lake Lanier GA

Re: One engine quits when shifting forward/reverse

Postby gofast24 » Wed Sep 30, 2015 7:04 am

ImRich wrote:I believe the 3861326 is actually a Denso TJ14R-P15, and not a NGK as I originally thought.

The Denso TJ14R-P15 is listed as a cross reference for the 41-983: http://www.globaldenso.com/en/products/ ... 001_1.html

Doing some research the AC-Delco 41-983 are also listed as 'double platinum', so I'm not sure what's really different here.

Yes, the VP OEM plug is a Denso TJ14R-P15, verified in my 2001 8.1 GSiI - A. A 4 pack from VP is $39.80 + shipping cost. The same 4 plugs thru Amazon are approx. $22 + free shipping.
gofast24
2001 Regal 4160
Twin VP 8.1GSiI V Drive Inboards
Lake Lanier, GA
gofast24
 
Posts: 2391
Joined: Mon Jan 26, 2015 12:03 pm
Location: Lake Lanier GA

Re: One engine quits when shifting forward/reverse

Postby ImRich » Sat Oct 03, 2015 7:21 am

gofast24 wrote:
ImRich wrote:This will have to continue next year as my boat was pulled this weekend.

I had no problems the last few cruises, but it only happens rarely.

Next year you might have the same problem? I dont think I will remember what the thread entailed 6 months from now. Without trying to read back 40+ posts just change the plugs if you have more than 500 hours on the propulsion engine. Only a couple bucks or so each?


I'll change the plugs, but the current 41-983 plugs have only about one season on them, probably less than 100 hours.
Rich
2005 - 3560
Unbelievable!
NH
ImRich
 
Posts: 980
Joined: Sat Apr 13, 2013 1:06 pm
Location: NH USA

Re: One engine quits when shifting forward/reverse

Postby ImRich » Sun Jun 12, 2016 5:42 am

A minor update on this issue.

Talking to my mechanic about this during spring launch he could only come up with the idea of loose wires at the ignition switch, so yesterday I checked the wires.

The screw that holds the violet wire to the starboard ignition switch was found to be just a bit loose. It wasn't loose enough for me to declare victory, but it was loose enough for me to consider that this could be the source of the issue. I could move the wire by hand on the terminal, but it wasn't loose enough to look like it could move on it's own. It definitely was not as tight as it should have been.

Only time will tell if this solves the issue or not. Let's hope it was the cause of this.
Rich
2005 - 3560
Unbelievable!
NH
ImRich
 
Posts: 980
Joined: Sat Apr 13, 2013 1:06 pm
Location: NH USA

Re: One engine quits when shifting forward/reverse

Postby gofast24 » Sun Jun 12, 2016 6:13 am

ImRich wrote:A minor update on this issue.

Talking to my mechanic about this during spring launch he could only come up with the idea of loose wires at the ignition switch, so yesterday I checked the wires.

The screw that holds the violet wire to the starboard ignition switch was found to be just a bit loose. It wasn't loose enough for me to declare victory, but it was loose enough for me to consider that this could be the source of the issue. I could move the wire by hand on the terminal, but it wasn't loose enough to look like it could move on it's own. It definitely was not as tight as it should have been.

Only time will tell if this solves the issue or not. Let's hope it was the cause of this.

We had a ignition switch go bad last month. It was the internal return spring that turned the key from the "crank" position back to the "run" position but its still possible the OP has a corroded contact inside the switch causing his problem as well. New ignition switch $18 and 5 minutes to re place (I did both while I was at it).
Regarding spark plugs, just checked a few of ours, clean, light grey in color, and no change in the gap (+/- 0.002") 856 hours on the original VP OEM plugs.
gofast24
2001 Regal 4160
Twin VP 8.1GSiI V Drive Inboards
Lake Lanier, GA
gofast24
 
Posts: 2391
Joined: Mon Jan 26, 2015 12:03 pm
Location: Lake Lanier GA

Re: One engine quits when shifting forward/reverse

Postby nawtical1 » Tue Jun 14, 2016 7:43 am

Rich,

I had an aggravating intermittent problem with my 3060 that went on for several months. Sometimes it would run fine then without explanation it would bog down on one engine. It finally was discovered to be corrosion on the fuel pump connections. Three mechanics and several $$$ later the problem was solved with a squirt of electrical spray. I certainly hope this solves your issue. It makes sense and I am sorry that one of us did not think about it last season.
WARNER
"Sol Poniente"
2004 3860 Hard Top
2005 Crowline 216 LS 350 Magnum Bravo III
310 Rib

Slidell La.
User avatar
nawtical1
2012 Regal Owners MULTIPLE Donator!
2012 Regal Owners MULTIPLE Donator!
 
Posts: 2085
Joined: Tue Nov 20, 2007 9:42 am

Re: One engine quits when shifting forward/reverse

Postby ImRich » Wed Jun 15, 2016 5:10 am

Unfortunately it will take about the whole season (or two seasons) to know for sure if this solved the problem.

This hint of where to check was my comment that the engine died as if the ignition was shut off, with no alarms of low oil pressure.

I'll certainly report back if it crops up again, but I am hopeful the issue is solved.
Rich
2005 - 3560
Unbelievable!
NH
ImRich
 
Posts: 980
Joined: Sat Apr 13, 2013 1:06 pm
Location: NH USA

Re: one engine quite when shifting forward/reverse

Postby catalina_mike » Wed Jun 15, 2016 3:12 pm

nawtical1 wrote:
ImRich wrote:The mechanic says there were no fault codes, so if a bad IAC valve or TPS sensor he would have expected a code.

I don't want to just throw parts without knowing there is a problem, unless there is a way to test these when a code is not in the ECU?

Gofast, or anyone else with these engines, if you turn on the ignition and not start the engine at all, does an alarm eventually sound? Or if you blip the ignition off, just long enough to kill the engine, but then turn the ignition switch on again (but the engine is off), will an alarm sound?

Is there a Volvo phone number I can call to talk to a tech to get some answers, or do only mechanics have this access? If I can do some troubleshooting myself, I can save some $$$$.


Rich,

Like your engines, if my engine cuts off there is no alarm. If I turn it back on immediately I don't recall the alarm/beep sounding either.

This is just a hunch but check the battery connections (load test if you can) on the engine that is cutting off. Intermittent low voltage could cause a cut off. (I know it does not make since because of the constant supply of power by alternator but I have seen it happen)


Alternators are not producing very high voltage and current / amps at idle. Full excitement and power starts around 2K to get things going. If all you do is in the idle range the alternator voltage regulator will not keep your battery charged. FYI
dolce far niente
Sold and sad (2009 4460)
Sea Ray 185 (Lake Arrowhead), Duffy B&B (Booze and Battery)
1999 Albin 28TE
User avatar
catalina_mike
2012 Regal Owners MULTIPLE Donator!
2012 Regal Owners MULTIPLE Donator!
 
Posts: 790
Joined: Mon Aug 10, 2009 6:39 pm

SOLVED Re: One engine quits when shifting forward/reverse

Postby ImRich » Mon Sep 26, 2016 7:36 am

It's the end of the season for me due to the lake being over 2 feel low caused by drought conditions here in NH. So I'm having my boat pulled this week. The channel to our boat hoist is getting very shallow, and I don't want to take a chance of having a problem as the lake continues to lose water. Normally these low water levels aren't seen until late November or December if its a low precipitation year.

The good news is that I haven't had one repeat of this quitting engine issue all year, so (knock on wood) I'll declare this solved with the loose starboard ignition key switch screw post as the root cause of the problem. Of course, I'll know for sure if it doesn't occur after the end of next season, but I'm feeling confident at this time , so I don't mind declaring victory.

Thanks to everyone for your thoughts and ideas on the original problem. It helped me isolate and check many things that I may have not thought about myself.

Please, everyone knock on wood for me as you read this post to help bring good luck that we solved this pesky problem! :)
Rich
2005 - 3560
Unbelievable!
NH
ImRich
 
Posts: 980
Joined: Sat Apr 13, 2013 1:06 pm
Location: NH USA

Re: SOLVED Re: One engine quits when shifting forward/revers

Postby gofast24 » Mon Sep 26, 2016 11:04 am

ImRich wrote:It's the end of the season for me due to the lake being over 2 feel low caused by drought conditions here in NH. So I'm having my boat pulled this week. The channel to our boat hoist is getting very shallow, and I don't want to take a chance of having a problem as the lake continues to lose water. Normally these low water levels aren't seen until late November or December if its a low precipitation year.

The good news is that I haven't had one repeat of this quitting engine issue all year, so (knock on wood) I'll declare this solved with the loose starboard ignition key switch screw post as the root cause of the problem. Of course, I'll know for sure if it doesn't occur after the end of next season, but I'm feeling confident at this time , so I don't mind declaring victory.

Thanks to everyone for your thoughts and ideas on the original problem. It helped me isolate and check many things that I may have not thought about myself.

Please, everyone knock on wood for me as you read this post to help bring good luck that we solved this pesky problem! :)

Knock, knock! I also hope it was just your ignition switch loose terminal. Keep us up to date if the problem re occurs!
gofast24
2001 Regal 4160
Twin VP 8.1GSiI V Drive Inboards
Lake Lanier, GA
gofast24
 
Posts: 2391
Joined: Mon Jan 26, 2015 12:03 pm
Location: Lake Lanier GA

Re: One engine quits when shifting forward/reverse

Postby michaels » Tue Sep 27, 2016 10:03 pm

I just happened to see this in the October 2016 Boating Magazine. Seems like it may be worth checking out.
Image
michaels
 
Posts: 6
Joined: Tue Sep 09, 2014 11:56 pm

Re: One engine quits when shifting forward/reverse

Postby ImRich » Wed Sep 28, 2016 3:30 pm

I wonder what the "Software Upgrade" does?

Does anyone have any information on this or have any connections with Volvo that can get information on it?

I wonder if you need to buy new ECMs, as I never heard of a new ECM firmware being installed before, but that doesn't mean it can't happen.
Rich
2005 - 3560
Unbelievable!
NH
ImRich
 
Posts: 980
Joined: Sat Apr 13, 2013 1:06 pm
Location: NH USA

Re: One engine quits when shifting forward/reverse

Postby Chris_in_Texas » Wed Sep 28, 2016 5:03 pm

Yea strange about the software for sure. I guess you could talk to VP sales rep. Ask your dealer to put you in touch with them. They do programing changes for performance all the time, not so much on VP engines, but in the Merc ones, so the ability to change the settings are there to adjust the fuel injector timings.

Wonder how much that would cost.. :shock:
Thanks, Chris

2012 - Regal 35 Sports Coupe - Twin VP 5.7GiCE-300-P - DP-SA - SOLD
2011 - Sea-Doo RXT260s - 1503HO Rotax 4TEC
2007 - Regal 3060 - Twin VP 5.0OSi - XDP - SOLD
2002 - Crownline 230BR VP 8.2GSiPEFS - DP-SM - SOLD
User avatar
Chris_in_Texas
2013 Regal Owners MULTIPLE Donator!
2013 Regal Owners MULTIPLE Donator!
 
Posts: 4378
Joined: Wed Mar 05, 2008 8:56 pm
Location: Frisco, TX (DFW Area)

Re: One engine quits when shifting forward/reverse

Postby Mischief Managed » Thu Sep 29, 2016 6:49 am

ImRich wrote:I wonder what the "Software Upgrade" does?

Does anyone have any information on this or have any connections with Volvo that can get information on it?

I wonder if you need to buy new ECMs, as I never heard of a new ECM firmware being installed before, but that doesn't mean it can't happen.


One of my New England boating friends bought some software that lets him re-program MEFI controlllers. I was thinking about boring and stroking my 454 to 489 and swapping in a 454MAG cam. If I do that, I'll use the software to re-map my MEFI3 and increase the rev limiter to 5200 RPM. You have MEFI4s, perhaps we could work something out if you can find a new MEFI4 map to load... The fix might be as simple as a 5% bump in injector opening time when the TPS is at idle.
Raymond NH, USA

Mischief Managed
2000 2550 LSC
7.4 MPI Bravo 3
Mischief Managed
 
Posts: 831
Joined: Fri Jun 13, 2008 11:03 am
Location: Raymond, NH, USA

Re: One engine quits when shifting forward/reverse

Postby ImRich » Fri Sep 30, 2016 9:11 am

Dave, interesting...

Looking at the data from my ECM I have the following versions:

ECM Hardware Version = 4 #
ECM Software Release = 18 #
ECM Software Revision = 161 #

So I'm not sure how this relates to anything newer for these 2004/2005 Vintage Volvo 8.1L Gi-E engines.

I'm still trying to dig up more info.

This season I didn't have any problems, so perhaps tightening the starboard ignition switch wire fixed the issue. However I did once have the port engine quit last year, so who knows if this software is also a contributing factor. I'd like to understand what 'new' software is available and what it 'fixes' or changes.
Rich
2005 - 3560
Unbelievable!
NH
ImRich
 
Posts: 980
Joined: Sat Apr 13, 2013 1:06 pm
Location: NH USA

PreviousNext

Return to Repair Shop

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 26 guests